As I tank I do agree, I miss times when all dps would have ktm installed to control their threat, however times changed, with aoe burst when focus on m+ is how quickly you finish the key fighting for threat is causing significant issues if you play with likes of fire mage. Dps won't slow down forcing tank meta back to mindless clapping to dish out more and more dmg.
Just starting with the fact that I will be playing Classic only as I like it the old way. But it used to be that fighting 2 mobs at a time was about what a group could handle safely in a dungeon, you needed to cc 2 mobs for each pack and fight the rest a bit away to not break cc. Sure if people know what to do or had good gear you could do more but the norm was to take it slow and save major cool downs for when the mage $%^&ed up. ;) I really liked it as it was not the action mash button game I feel wow have become today. By all means I don’t have the 8 hours to clear the big dungeons that I had back in Vanilla but I still love the design even though dungeons have to be smaller for me to do them full in one go, but the point is that threat was not an issue for the tank back then, it was an “issue” for the group to handle and it was part of the challenge of the dungeon and the game.
Threat gameplay just isn't fun in a time where the abilities don't line up. In early WoW you had things like mocking blow, AE taunt, etc. None of that exists anymore. I'm not sure why they continue trying to make threat tenuous outside of special mechanics without improving the options to interact with it.
Maybe they should just make tank essences not completely awful.None of them feel good except maybe the AoE burst, but even then, it's got such a long CD and doesn't actually deal that much damage. I'm just looking at essences as a tank trying to determine which is less garbage for a said fight...
Why not give each tank spec abilities (or modify existing abilities) that generates high threat and has to be reapplied periodically? Like one ability for single target threat generation (like taunt maybe?) and another ability for multi-target threat generation? Something that doesn't have diminishing returns if used correctly...
I play a guardian druid, I'm currently 438 ilvl since I got lucky with drops and am 1 of the highest ilvls in our raid. I run with dps such as demon hunters, rogues, and frost mages, which are all known for their burst, and with the essences it is a pretty constant battle if any one of them uses them on a pack. For the record, I'm running full dps traits and trinkets (3x twisted claws, 3x wild fleshrending, cyclotronic blast etc), and my dps on a big pack is comparable to one of the dps'. However, because it's not burst damage like the beam, there are still moments when aggro will drop, which just doesn't feel good from a tanking perspective, since there's literally nothing else I can be doing to help the situation. Even when taking the Anima essence, there are pulls where its snap aggro is not enough to counter a well-timed beam, and the 2 minute cd certainly doesn't help either. I feel like these aggro issues are just going to bar more people from trying tanking out, a role which is already underrepresented in keys, since it always feels like there's something that you could be doing better.
It's easy to answer why its bad now and was great back then, threat game was enjoyable and great imo in wrath and cata, now its just a pain in the ass. But back then you didnt run dungeons for a timer, in most cases. Now you do, which makes is frustrating, you cant just w8 for the tank to get enough aggro over every pack you pull, when you try to accomplish a +15.. Timed runs are fun and made dungeons matter again, but tank threat issues makes is very frustrating sometimes.
Does a major trait really add 9% DPS on average? I do appreciate it's more complicate than that with the damage being on a cooldown and so creating a temporary burst that the tank can't match but I was surprised how large the percentage increase was.If it's only one mob coming late to the party, surely that DK (and every tank) has a... taunt button for it? If there's a few mobs then I do see the problem there
As a blood DK - as a player - I want more difficulty in the game. Threat management is not something that negatively affects my experience - it, slightly, enhances it. It's something I need to be aware of - to quickly react to. If I want to pull 2-3+ groups, then there needs to be consequences beyond more damage. There are, and always have been, easy options, with "holding off DPS" not being the necessary one.
The problem with having dps control the amount off dps they are doing so as to not pull threat off of tanks might have worked back in the day, but there is a reason dps nowadays are prioritized with gear instead of tanks and healers cause most mechanics or boss encounters now are mostly dps checks and if your group isn’t doing the maximum amount of dps they can cause of them trying to control their aggro then it makes most encounters nearly impossible to deal with.
People seem to miss the core issue here.Yes, tanks should have to manage threat - it's the job.But, tanks must have abilities that *can* manage threat. The fact that essence dps will outscale tank treat is a major problem - especially with the very design of the essences (huge nuke, big CD). Will players adjust? Sure, but I expect (and I likely will) be even *more* restrictive on what dps I let into my M+ runs. This change is going to make it harder for dps to find tanks, imo.
I deeply disliked it when they started putting gaps & cooldowns into the primary tank rotations.Spamming bloodboil or thunderclap isn't interesting, but should be a workable baseline & we're at a point where that approach is starting to fail.When a tank can see they're losing a mob, select it & deliberately hit it with a single target attack - that's interesting skill based gameplay. Currently a good tank can get a fair way by stacking haste & being on-point with target selection, but the lack of always-available high-threat single target attacks is what really makes the situation untenable (imo).
Why can't they get anything right atm? At this point there is no meaning in threat management anyways, since we do not have the tools for it anymore - neither DPS nor Tanks. I mean, I do not want the times back when I had to endlessly spam Sunder Armor for threat. But if they reduce the threat generation to a critical level, they should add some tools for managing it.And binding threat generation to something like the AP grind is pretty much the most stupid thing they can do. But, right now, it feels like if there is a most stupid option, Blizzard will pretty much choose exactly that one. Seriously, how should a just rerolled tank have a chance here? I don't have any problems if I am a few percent in damage behind someone who played the same class since start of the addon. But in the case of tanks, the whole group is affected, not only my personal DPS.
For the record, Omen doesn't have a "ratio". It reports the threat numbers provided by the game. Someone needs to fact check their information. It makes no sense to "scale" Omen values by anything, since those are literally the threat numbers the game uses.Also, since you are talking in percentages, your scaling is pointless anyway, since 8% is 8%, no matter how much you scale it.